Decisions

Post by ricardo lafuente
1. We talked about changing the VCS. Since there is no libre hosting
facility for Mercurial and our benefactors at Goto10 are probably shutting
down the server, we have two alternatives: shift to Git and move the code
hosting to Gitorious, or shift to Bzr and move to Launchpad.
My preference after looking into both alternatives is Git and Gitorious.
However, it would be great to have a Launchpad project page with support for
issue tracking, translations and all the other goodies. Does anyone know if
it's possible or not to have a Launchpad project page with an external code
repository?

I suggest that, if you are going to use Launchpad, then use
Launchpad's BZR repo hosting, and recommend people use git-bzr/bzr-git
to interface with the central repo if they want to use Git.

stackoverflow.com/questions/3298940/cant-push-changes-back-to-launchpad-using-git-bzr

https://launchpad.net/bzr-git

Post by ricardo lafuente
2. I'm now almost done with packaging for the Shoebot core. I had to take
out the libs because they contain binary files, which are bad for packaging,

Sorry if we discussed this already, I've forgotten: What binary files? :-)

Post by ricardo lafuente
and i don't know much about possible solutions to this; also, separating
core and libs was in the roadmap for a long time. A makeshift solution would
be to have a separate repository for the libs and provide a tar snapshot in
the website.
3. Sebastian has done a great deal of work in revamping the Shoebot website.
Only task remaining is to migrate the content. I'm working on this.

Cool!

--
Cheers
Dave

ricardo lafuente

2010-09-29 17:08:51 UTC

I suggest that, if you are going to use Launchpad, then use
Launchpad's BZR repo hosting, and recommend people use git-bzr/bzr-git
to interface with the central repo if they want to use Git.

Alright, if there's no objections, we move with this solution!

Post by ricardo lafuente
2. I'm now almost done with packaging for the Shoebot core. I had to take
out the libs because they contain binary files, which are bad for packaging,

Sorry if we discussed this already, I've forgotten: What binary files? :-)

I think we didn't, don't worry :-)

There are a few .so files around (on Superformula, OpenCV and maybe
others). This is a no-no for packaging since they're compiled already,
and we should provide the source instead. We can probably solve this
with the Nodebox guys, but for the moment i already have quite a bit on
my plate...

So we can just provide the libs separately (and place them in their own
repo) along with a simple script to install them alongside shoebot, at
least while we wait for a proper solution for the deb packaging.

Dave Crossland

2010-09-29 17:17:51 UTC

There are a few .so files around (on Superformula, OpenCV and maybe others).
This is a no-no for packaging since they're compiled already, and we should
provide the source instead. We can probably solve this with the Nodebox
guys, but for the moment i already have quite a bit on my plate...

Do they also bundle .so files?

ricardo lafuente

2010-09-29 17:46:14 UTC

Do they also bundle .so files?

Yes, the libs as they are carry a few. I'm rather n00bish when it comes
to this subject, but i think they're C/C++ extensions.

This is not an issue on OSX (Nodebox's native platform) since the
architecture is pretty much set on Apple machines. However, a source
package should not by principle include them since they're arch-specific.

So i *think* the necessary tasks would be to
1. Try and get the source code for those binaries
2. Create makefiles for compiling those sources when building Shoebot
3. Tweak the setup.py to include those libraries for compiling
4. Profit

Feel free to correct me though :-)

architetto francesco fantoni <hva - hermanitos verdes architetti>

2010-09-29 18:54:34 UTC

Do they also bundle .so files?

I must admit I had completely forgotten the binary extension stuff.

A) - For what it concerns the supershape library, the C extension at
present is not actually used by shoebot, because the binary version is
compiled for MacOS, normally the lib looks for it, and if it cant be
loaded, it goes with pure-python functions.
We have two options there:
1) just remove the binary and the library will keep working the same.
2) if we want to speed calculation, the original nodebox library comes
with the c source too, and a setup.py to build it on Mac. we could
re-distribute the source and tweak the setup.py in order to make it
compile on linux.

B) - The opencv library it is not a nodebox library, but a native
shoebot one I wrote two years ago.
The binary part is actually an extension that came from here:
http://code.google.com/p/pyblobs/
and it's a Python interface to cvBlobsLib, used for blobs extraction.
The source is available and it was compiled using swig, so compilation
could be done.
The main problem is anyway that since then the opencv structure seems to
have evolved a lot, and today, when I tried, I could not even get the
pyblobs compiled on a recent version of Ubuntu, i suspect due to
internal changes in opencv code, but I have not investigated much.
So at the moment, part of the opencv shoebot library (the blobs
detection) is very likely not working on up to date systems and a bit of
investigation and of work should be done to see how to put the blob
functionality back. The other functions and parts of the library,
including face detection, are supposed to be working (I had tested it
not so long ago).
I should indeed have a look at opencv documentation, I will try to do it
if I can.

Another theme to consider is the Nodebox libraries license. In general
they are distributed under a MIT license, so they're re-distributable,
and you can modify them, as long as you keep the license txt on the
package, others, as the colors library, are released under the GPL, but
for example the supershape library is released with a MIT license, but
is usable only for non-commercial use, so I guess the easiest way is to
make them downloadable from the site, maybe like Nodebox, with a page
for each library containing some notes about their API and their usage,
with little examples.

francesco

Post by ricardo lafuente
Yes, the libs as they are carry a few. I'm rather n00bish when it comes
to this subject, but i think they're C/C++ extensions.
This is not an issue on OSX (Nodebox's native platform) since the
architecture is pretty much set on Apple machines. However, a source
package should not by principle include them since they're arch-specific.
So i *think* the necessary tasks would be to
1. Try and get the source code for those binaries
2. Create makefiles for compiling those sources when building Shoebot
3. Tweak the setup.py to include those libraries for compiling
4. Profit
Feel free to correct me though :-)
_______________________________________________
Shoebot-devel mailing list
http://lists.tinkerhouse.net/listinfo.cgi/shoebot-devel-tinkerhouse.net

architetto francesco fantoni <hva - hermanitos verdes architetti>

2010-09-29 19:21:05 UTC

Post by architetto francesco fantoni <hva - hermanitos verdes architetti>

Ok, I've committed some changes in order to start to work out the binary
parts in libraries issues.

A) - removed binary extension from supershape library, source is there
and can be compiled, but I didn't tweak the setup.py yet.
meanwhile supershape formula will be calculated in pure python, as it
actually has always been as the previous binary was the Mac one that
came with nodebox original library.

B) - I could get pyblobs to compile on Ubuntu Lucid at last.
I've added, inside the sbopencv directory, a "pyblobs_src" subdirectory,
you must cd to pyblobs_src and the run "./make_swig_shadow.sh" script.
the script will ask if you want to install the required dependencies and
then build the blobs extension in a "blobs" subdirectory of sbopencv
lib, after that the library should work as before.
I actually has not tested if it really works with the Lucid version of
opencv, but it compiles ok, and it's a good step at least.

I will try to investigate more later.

best, francesco

Il giorno mer, 29/09/2010 alle 20.54 +0200, architetto francesco fantoni

Do they also bundle .so files?

I must admit I had completely forgotten the binary extension stuff.
A) - For what it concerns the supershape library, the C extension at
present is not actually used by shoebot, because the binary version is
compiled for MacOS, normally the lib looks for it, and if it cant be
loaded, it goes with pure-python functions.
1) just remove the binary and the library will keep working the same.
2) if we want to speed calculation, the original nodebox library comes
with the c source too, and a setup.py to build it on Mac. we could
re-distribute the source and tweak the setup.py in order to make it
compile on linux.
B) - The opencv library it is not a nodebox library, but a native
shoebot one I wrote two years ago.
http://code.google.com/p/pyblobs/
and it's a Python interface to cvBlobsLib, used for blobs extraction.
The source is available and it was compiled using swig, so compilation
could be done.
The main problem is anyway that since then the opencv structure seems to
have evolved a lot, and today, when I tried, I could not even get the
pyblobs compiled on a recent version of Ubuntu, i suspect due to
internal changes in opencv code, but I have not investigated much.
So at the moment, part of the opencv shoebot library (the blobs
detection) is very likely not working on up to date systems and a bit of
investigation and of work should be done to see how to put the blob
functionality back. The other functions and parts of the library,
including face detection, are supposed to be working (I had tested it
not so long ago).
I should indeed have a look at opencv documentation, I will try to do it
if I can.
Another theme to consider is the Nodebox libraries license. In general
they are distributed under a MIT license, so they're re-distributable,
and you can modify them, as long as you keep the license txt on the
package, others, as the colors library, are released under the GPL, but
for example the supershape library is released with a MIT license, but
is usable only for non-commercial use, so I guess the easiest way is to
make them downloadable from the site, maybe like Nodebox, with a page
for each library containing some notes about their API and their usage,
with little examples.
francesco

_______________________________________________
Shoebot-devel mailing list
http://lists.tinkerhouse.net/listinfo.cgi/shoebot-devel-tinkerhouse.net

Dave Crossland

2010-09-29 20:00:31 UTC

On 29 September 2010 21:21, architetto francesco fantoni <hva -

Post by architetto francesco fantoni <hva - hermanitos verdes architetti>
I will try to investigate more later.

Wow Francesco! Great work! :)

architetto francesco fantoni <hva - hermanitos verdes architetti>

2010-09-29 20:06:12 UTC

Post by architetto francesco fantoni <hva - hermanitos verdes architetti>

seems opencv in lucid is rather buggy, I'm testing and I have a lot of
segfaults...

Il giorno mer, 29/09/2010 alle 21.21 +0200, architetto francesco fantoni

Post by architetto francesco fantoni <hva - hermanitos verdes architetti>
Ok, I've committed some changes in order to start to work out the binary
parts in libraries issues.
A) - removed binary extension from supershape library, source is there
and can be compiled, but I didn't tweak the setup.py yet.
meanwhile supershape formula will be calculated in pure python, as it
actually has always been as the previous binary was the Mac one that
came with nodebox original library.
B) - I could get pyblobs to compile on Ubuntu Lucid at last.
I've added, inside the sbopencv directory, a "pyblobs_src" subdirectory,
you must cd to pyblobs_src and the run "./make_swig_shadow.sh" script.
the script will ask if you want to install the required dependencies and
then build the blobs extension in a "blobs" subdirectory of sbopencv
lib, after that the library should work as before.
I actually has not tested if it really works with the Lucid version of
opencv, but it compiles ok, and it's a good step at least.
I will try to investigate more later.
best, francesco
Il giorno mer, 29/09/2010 alle 20.54 +0200, architetto francesco fantoni

Do they also bundle .so files?

I must admit I had completely forgotten the binary extension stuff.
A) - For what it concerns the supershape library, the C extension at
present is not actually used by shoebot, because the binary version is
compiled for MacOS, normally the lib looks for it, and if it cant be
loaded, it goes with pure-python functions.
1) just remove the binary and the library will keep working the same.
2) if we want to speed calculation, the original nodebox library comes
with the c source too, and a setup.py to build it on Mac. we could
re-distribute the source and tweak the setup.py in order to make it
compile on linux.
B) - The opencv library it is not a nodebox library, but a native
shoebot one I wrote two years ago.
http://code.google.com/p/pyblobs/
and it's a Python interface to cvBlobsLib, used for blobs extraction.
The source is available and it was compiled using swig, so compilation
could be done.
The main problem is anyway that since then the opencv structure seems to
have evolved a lot, and today, when I tried, I could not even get the
pyblobs compiled on a recent version of Ubuntu, i suspect due to
internal changes in opencv code, but I have not investigated much.
So at the moment, part of the opencv shoebot library (the blobs
detection) is very likely not working on up to date systems and a bit of
investigation and of work should be done to see how to put the blob
functionality back. The other functions and parts of the library,
including face detection, are supposed to be working (I had tested it
not so long ago).
I should indeed have a look at opencv documentation, I will try to do it
if I can.
Another theme to consider is the Nodebox libraries license. In general
they are distributed under a MIT license, so they're re-distributable,
and you can modify them, as long as you keep the license txt on the
package, others, as the colors library, are released under the GPL, but
for example the supershape library is released with a MIT license, but
is usable only for non-commercial use, so I guess the easiest way is to
make them downloadable from the site, maybe like Nodebox, with a page
for each library containing some notes about their API and their usage,
with little examples.
francesco

_______________________________________________
Shoebot-devel mailing list
http://lists.tinkerhouse.net/listinfo.cgi/shoebot-devel-tinkerhouse.net

architetto francesco fantoni <hva - hermanitos verdes architetti>

2010-09-29 20:42:43 UTC

Post by architetto francesco fantoni <hva - hermanitos verdes architetti>

I guess it's going to be worth waiting until the new python opencv
interface gets into Ubuntu before revamping sbopencv library

http://opencv.willowgarage.com/documentation/python/introduction.html

Il giorno mer, 29/09/2010 alle 22.06 +0200, architetto francesco fantoni

Post by architetto francesco fantoni <hva - hermanitos verdes architetti>
seems opencv in lucid is rather buggy, I'm testing and I have a lot of
segfaults...
Il giorno mer, 29/09/2010 alle 21.21 +0200, architetto francesco fantoni

Do they also bundle .so files?

I must admit I had completely forgotten the binary extension stuff.
A) - For what it concerns the supershape library, the C extension at
present is not actually used by shoebot, because the binary version is
compiled for MacOS, normally the lib looks for it, and if it cant be
loaded, it goes with pure-python functions.
1) just remove the binary and the library will keep working the same.
2) if we want to speed calculation, the original nodebox library comes
with the c source too, and a setup.py to build it on Mac. we could
re-distribute the source and tweak the setup.py in order to make it
compile on linux.
B) - The opencv library it is not a nodebox library, but a native
shoebot one I wrote two years ago.
http://code.google.com/p/pyblobs/
and it's a Python interface to cvBlobsLib, used for blobs extraction.
The source is available and it was compiled using swig, so compilation
could be done.
The main problem is anyway that since then the opencv structure seems to
have evolved a lot, and today, when I tried, I could not even get the
pyblobs compiled on a recent version of Ubuntu, i suspect due to
internal changes in opencv code, but I have not investigated much.
So at the moment, part of the opencv shoebot library (the blobs
detection) is very likely not working on up to date systems and a bit of
investigation and of work should be done to see how to put the blob
functionality back. The other functions and parts of the library,
including face detection, are supposed to be working (I had tested it
not so long ago).
I should indeed have a look at opencv documentation, I will try to do it
if I can.
Another theme to consider is the Nodebox libraries license. In general
they are distributed under a MIT license, so they're re-distributable,
and you can modify them, as long as you keep the license txt on the
package, others, as the colors library, are released under the GPL, but
for example the supershape library is released with a MIT license, but
is usable only for non-commercial use, so I guess the easiest way is to
make them downloadable from the site, maybe like Nodebox, with a page
for each library containing some notes about their API and their usage,
with little examples.
francesco

_______________________________________________
Shoebot-devel mailing list
http://lists.tinkerhouse.net/listinfo.cgi/shoebot-devel-tinkerhouse.net

Stuart Axon

2010-09-30 01:09:43 UTC

Sent: Wed, September 29, 2010 6:08:51 PM
Subject: Re: [shoebot-devel] Decisions

1. We talked about changing the VCS. Since there is no libre hosting
facility for Mercurial and our benefactors at Goto10 are probably shutting
down the server, we have two alternatives: shift to Git and move the code
hosting to Gitorious, or shift to Bzr and move to Launchpad.
My preference after looking into both alternatives is Git and Gitorious.
However, it would be great to have a Launchpad project page with support

for

issue tracking, translations and all the other goodies. Does anyone know

it's possible or not to have a Launchpad project page with an external

code

repository?

I suggest that, if you are going to use Launchpad, then use
Launchpad's BZR repo hosting, and recommend people use git-bzr/bzr-git
to interface with the central repo if they want to use Git.

Alright, if there's no objections, we move with this solution!

I would like to be able to merge my branch at some point; if we move to git will
the history be preserved ?

Also, it would be good to test that checking stuff out from bzr works on windows
OK.

2. I'm now almost done with packaging for the Shoebot core. I had to take
out the libs because they contain binary files, which are bad for

packaging,

Sorry if we discussed this already, I've forgotten: What binary files? :-)

I think we didn't, don't worry :-)
There are a few .so files around (on Superformula, OpenCV and maybe others).
This is a no-no for packaging since they're compiled already, and we should
provide the source instead. We can probably solve this with the Nodebox guys,
but for the moment i already have quite a bit on my plate...
So we can just provide the libs separately (and place them in their own repo)
along with a simple script to install them alongside shoebot, at least while we
wait for a proper solution for the deb packaging.
_______________________________________________
Shoebot-devel mailing list
http://lists.tinkerhouse.net/listinfo.cgi/shoebot-devel-tinkerhouse.net

Dave Crossland

2010-09-30 09:04:31 UTC

Post by Stuart Axon
I would like to be able to merge my branch at some point; if we move to git will
the history be preserved ?

http://stackoverflow.com/questions/79165/how-to-migrate-svn-with-history-to-a-new-git-repository
:)

Stuart Axon

2010-09-30 15:09:01 UTC

Sent: Thu, September 30, 2010 10:04:31 AM
Subject: Re: [shoebot-devel] Decisions

I would like to be able to merge my branch at some point; if we move to git

will

the history be preserved ?

http://stackoverflow.com/questions/79165/how-to-migrate-svn-with-history-to-a-new-git-repository
y
:)

I think mecurial -> bzr would be the one needed.

From what I read launchpad uses git-bzr, which doesn't support git pull...

although I don't know much about git + less about bzr, so not sure if it's
important.

It's not the end of the world it can't be done, it would just be nice if the new
bzr versions knew that they came from the same source as it might make merging
easier later (+ preserve all individual changes in my branch before the merge).

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Shoebot-devel mailing list
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Stuart Axon

2010-09-30 17:36:31 UTC